F53
Ethical dilemmas - what would you do?
November 14 2013
Comments
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RHP User
12 years ago
I was confronted with a lose-lose situation on Tuesday. I was travelling sling a road and came to a signposted T junction. Left to St Marys or right to Mt Druitt..... ;-)- Posted from rhpmobile
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him_and_me
12 years ago
Who is the pregnant woman? Is she carry the prodigal son? Does her unborn child have a disability? Does she have in her blood the only know cure for all cancers and dementia and colour-blindness and obesity? Is she an opera singer? Does she have freckles?How large is the group behind her? Are they men or women? Are they criminals? Or leaders of the world's nations? Are they vegetarians? Do they smoke?What's outside the cave? Will there be sharks/jellyfish/electric eels in the water? Could the cliff collapse on them all? Are there other people still in the world or is this the last remaining pocket of humanity?Ok ok, I'm being a little bit silly. The question, is it better to sacrifice the life of one mother and her unborn child to ensure the safety of a group of people?I have no idea how to answer that. Sorry.x Me
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RHP User
12 years ago
Blow her up ... maybe even take advantage of her precarious situation first, I mean she is going to be dead soon anyway? That'll get a few minds ticking ... you there Coops Assuming they means more than 2 it is quite easy to answer that one from a theoretical point of view. How can you justify killing 3+ to save 1 (maybe 2) ?It is all academic anyway, as you alluded to in real life there would be no dilemma ... those stuck would do what they could to survive ... no way they just all accept death to save the woman (whom presumably only 1 is emotionally attached to.) I guess if it is one of those trick questions where 'everyone else' means her grandparents, parents and husband in which case it is feasible they might have the balls for it.
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RHP User
12 years ago
Use the dynamite. "If they do not use it everyone will drown." For me there's no dilemma. You could swap 'pregnant woman' for 'young guy', 'child', 'old woman' and my answer would be the same.- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
Couldn't they use the dynamite to blow another opening in the cave so they can escape? And if she got in, how come she can't get out?
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RHP User
12 years ago
...you put forward Sun_Kissed is one I feel is impossible for a person outside of the specific situation to answer as the choice is ultimately of the people involved. But if you are are asking what, for example, you would do if you were the guy with the dynamite, then that could indeed be answered. My thoughts are as follows, if I were any member of the group I would leave the decision to the pregnant lady and accept my fate knowing that when I died I did not take another persons life to save my own. I do not believe in an afterlife so I wouldn't be able to think back in hind sight to see if indeed I made the correct decision. If I were the pregnant woman who was stuck, I really don't know if I can answer that either as I have never conceived a child, nor have the ability to conceive a child (even though I look in calf most of the time), so have no innate knowledge of how I would react emotionally. If it were me, personally, stuck then blow me to pieces! But please make use of my tenderised flesh to catch fish or crustaceans if no food is available and hunting is necessary. :)
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RHP User
12 years ago
The point of an ethical dilemma is to accept the scenario as it's described and make a choice. I'm intrigued by how difficult people find that. I think I'd fight to the last minute to free her, then die in the explosion with her. I have a 'leave no-one behind' thing and I need frightened people to know I have their back. I also don't have an intrinsic value for life. I'd be terrified of the pain but I don't think I'd fight to keep myself alive. You just don't know though. - Posted from rhpmobile
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madotara69
12 years ago
First one to say blow up the mother in child, shove the stick of dynamite up their arse, strategically place that person so that the mother to be will be protected from the blast, blown free and only covered with bits of arsehole. Every one else gets to go home and call the kid Charlie.Mado
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RHP User
12 years ago
Quoting 'Mischeviouslad' I was confronted with a lose-lose situation on Tuesday. I was travelling sling a road and came to a signposted T junction. Left to St Marys or right to Mt Druitt..... ;-)- Posted from rhpmobile Do a U-Turn to go back from whence you came and escape that hellish nightmare! - Winning!
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RHP User
12 years ago
Living proof here!!!! :) FOXY- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
If I were the pregnant woman, the only obligation I have is to myself and unborn child before anyone else. FOXY- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
Extract the baby to decrease her size, everyone pee on her and push. Light dynamite and throw back into cave once clear so to prevent this happening again..Well you did ask!
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RHP User
12 years ago
I know it's only hypothetical BUT, dynamite would probably end up causing the cave to collapse. And if only the woman's head is free, then the unborn baby would perish with the rest of the group. I think.Anyway, who let the pregnant woman lead!? Why's she in a cave!? Who the shit carries dynamite so casually!? Why's it a man who's carrying explosives!? I'm not good at these questions.How easy is it to force immediate child birth? If it's do-able, then everyone could get birthing and slip out and celebrate. With dynamite.
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RHP User
12 years ago
Quoting 'Sun_Kissed' The point of an ethical dilemma is to accept the scenario as it's described and make a choice. I'm intrigued by how difficult people find that. I think I'd fight to the last minute to free her, then die in the explosion with her. I have a 'leave no-one behind' thing and I need frightened people to know I have their back. I also don't have an intrinsic value for life. I'd be terrified of the pain but I don't think I'd fight to keep myself alive. You just don't know though. - Posted from rhpmobile I know the rules of the game but I do wonder whether they have not put enough thought into the scenario so there are only two choices. How often are there only two choices? Sorry Sun-Kissed, I just couldn't accept making either of those choices when my mind was clearly telling me there could be another way out without the pregnant woman or anyone else dying.
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RHP User
12 years ago
Sacrifice the mother . Save the unborn child and the rest of the Group . Save the Dynamite for a rainy day . GG♒️- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
How far along is she anyway? At what stage does a bunch of cells become a human being?
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RHP User
12 years ago
we all die....she and her unborn have a chance to survive...would you really kill someone in this circumstance...or hope that another will do it?
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RHP User
12 years ago
But Freya, the woman and her cells/embryo/foetus will die eventually as well. And yes, whoever says "Kill her", should be prepared to it themselves. So, then what's worse: Actively killing her, or passively killing the rest by standing by and not doing anything?
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RHP User
12 years ago
Waking up feeling like you're recovering from an autopsy, only to discover that beside you in the bed is a dead hooker.... Do you:- A) scream B) call 000 C) enjoy the free hour Isn't it?? :p But to answer seriously, people have achieved many superhuman feats of survival, from removing limbs with a pocket knife, to lifting buses on their own. So to answer this, I would have to I honestly don't know, as this is a question assuming a particular mindset that's near impossible to simulate. Sorry I can't be of any help :) - Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
Bothered replying to my messages... Sorry babe, you're going down... Hehe Sorry, the group lives. Yes, of course we try to get her out, maybe even emergency Caesar... (How old is this fetus you speak of ?) If we did nothing and we drowned and she lived... Then she's still stuck and she's surrounded by dead friends... Don't get shipwrecked with hp... Cause one of us might not make it back... 👀 Hp xo 💌 Because you're worth it...
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RHP User
12 years ago
If the hole was only big enough for the cave it means no one would fit through anyways. So really the dynamite should of been used before she put her head through. She cant be that dumb to not see it... if she was then use the dynamite- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
In this scenario, as it's written, the problem is that while everyone's desperately scrambling to 'find another way' no-one's facing the reality that there are only two options. Either the mother (and presumably the baby) dies, or everyone dies. If no-one's willing to face what is, then the default outcome is death for everyone. There isn't always a hero who saves the day MacGyver-style. Sometimes people have to choose. That's why ethical dilemmas are so damned difficult :)- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
I am not responsible for another's choices....I think the details are irrelevant,the question is would you sacrifice one or two for the so called greater good of the group...and would that really be for the greater good...how would you live with that decision?...happy to sacrifice me though.
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RHP User
12 years ago
We live and live with the consequences. Survival is a natural instinct
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RHP User
12 years ago
a truck driver in Queensland rescued a baby from a burning car..seconds later the car blew up killing the baby's young mother..the truck driver did not think about his survival...
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Almost_Ready
12 years ago
With all this carry on bet you forgot about the bloody matches
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RHP User
12 years ago
faced a different scenario and in that situation most people would have done the same
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RHP User
12 years ago
I heard that on the news.So sad for the child but yet a hero of a man.Foxy
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RHP User
12 years ago
Quoting 'Sun_Kissed' In this scenario, as it's written, the problem is that while everyone's desperately scrambling to 'find another way' no-one's facing the reality that there are only two options. Either the mother (and presumably the baby) dies, or everyone dies. If no-one's willing to face what is, then the default outcome is death for everyone. There isn't always a hero who saves the day MacGyver-style. Sometimes people have to choose. That's why ethical dilemmas are so damned difficult :)- Posted from rhpmobile Procrastination! We'd all be dead if left up to me. I reckon I would be running around like the proverbial headless chook trying to find another way because the thought of taking someone else's life is just too difficult for me. I wouldn't want to be with me in a crisis.
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RHP User
12 years ago
Given explosives work best encapsulated I wonder where to place it to have best effect?;-) Lucky it's a hypothetical if unrealistic situation to be in!- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
Given she was selfish enough and stupid enough to stick her head in the only escape passage and in turn endanger everyone else you have to ask do we want her to procreate??;-) Again..... Blast her!- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
Btw am only stirring put away the hammer! Haha- Posted from rhpmobile
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RHP User
12 years ago
...then you should check out some of the 'quizzes' on philosophersnet.com/games/ The cave, pregnant woman dilemma seems like a different take on the famous 'trolley problem' (aka 'trolley dilemma') that Philippa Foot came up with back in the 60's and is used widely (initially by philosophers, but now also by psychologists, neuroethicists and cognitive scientists) to evaluate and explain moral decision making. Some fascinating research showing how different phrasing or scenarios of essentially the same dilemma result in different choices being made as different parts of the brain are activated. The more emotionally neutral the scenario (eg, an old woman instead of a pregnant woman) or the less direct the harm (ie, you just have to push a button) result in the parts of our brains involved in higher cognition (reason, logic, math, etc...) being activated and in turn a more utilitarian moral decision being made - sacrifice one to save many. But, the more emotionally charged, either because of the person, or you have to directly harm them, rather than just pushing a button, lighting a fuse, etc... the less that part of our brain gets activated and the more regions that deal with emotional conflict do, resulting in less utilitarian decisions. (Joshua Greene from Harvard is one of the main researchers in that space and his 'Moral Tribes' book is a good read). Anyway, as I'm more of a consequentialist in terms of my moral system (bordering on utilitarian), and playing by the rules of it being a binary choice between killing the pregnant woman with dynamite, or everyone dying, I'd have to say they should light the fuse...
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RHP User
12 years ago
i was going to post; for the greater good I would blow up the pregnant woman to save everyone else including myself, i didn't even have to think twice about it. but after seeing all the other responses, i felt a bit embarrassed....and thought to myself, am i normal?haha
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